Doyle Brunson: Poker's Living Legend

In the land of poker legends, only one is qualified to sit at the head table. He is the man whose early gunslinging, road gambling days imbued him with a near mythological presence in poker's highest circles. He is the only man who has played at the highest levels and stakes for more than 50 years. He is a man who has won back-to-back world championships, published poker's top-selling book of all time, and was the first to pocket seven figures from his overall tournament wins.

Doyle Brunson, now 72, has lived a life unmatched by anyone. If you add up all the stories, all the history, and all the accomplishments, he has had a hand in writing most of poker's most important chapters.

As the patriarch of modern poker, Card Player honored Doyle with the inaugural Lifetime Achievement Award at the Card Player 2005 Player of the Year Awards banquet.

I sat down with poker's godfather in advance of the 37th-annual World Series of Poker to look back at one of modern sports' most amazing stories of tenacity, dedication, competition, and, of course, a little gamble.

Justin Marchand: You are a legend. Anyone who knows anything about poker knows your story. But what are three things that not many people know about Doyle Brunson?

Doyle Brunson: Three things they don't know … well, I swim every day, I watch Everyone Loves Raymond every day (Doyle loves Brad Garrett, who hosted Card Player's Player of the Year Gala, and Garrett will also be the master of ceremonies at Brunson's roast at this year's World Series of Poker), and I have a dog named Casper that has bitten 28 people.

JM: You've been able to rise above serious adversity in your life. Throughout your life, what did it take, mentally and physically, for you to persevere and continue to fulfill your dreams?

DB: Life is like poker. You don't get the hand that you want dealt to you all the time, and you just have to play the hand that you are dealt and play it to the best of your abilities. That's what I tried to do then and what I try to do now. When you get some tough hands to play, you just do it the best you can.

JM: Do you believe in miracles? The fact that both you and your wife had cancerous tumors disappear, it seems as if you are blessed and chosen to do great things.

DB: Absolutely. I am walking proof that there is such a thing. I am in the record books at the cancer hospital for spontaneous remission when there is no explanation for tumors just disappearing. I don't know about chosen to do great things. I just try to live life to the fullest and enjoy every day, because I appreciate life a lot more since that happened.

JM: So, you started as an athlete, a teacher, worked briefly as a salesperson and then hit the poker table. When was the first time you ever played poker for money and how soon afterward did it become your profession?

DB: The first time I played was at the state basketball championship when I was a senior in high school. And I played a little in college. After I graduated from college, I paid for my way through graduate school by playing poker. I guess you could say it became my passion then.

JM: So, what was it about poker that attracted you to the game; money, competition, an element of danger?

DB: The competitiveness. Since I couldn't compete as an athlete anymore, I could now compete at the poker table.

JM: Can you talk a bit about your evolution as a player and a road gambler? When and where did you start playing? What games did you begin playing back in the 1950s?

DB: I started playing after I went to work as a salesperson for the Burroughs Corporation. I quit after less than a year to play poker full time, and after that I never held another job. I played on the north side of Fort Worth for about two years. Then, I went downtown where the professional types, the doctors and lawyers, played, where there were bigger games, for a year. Then, I went to the Texas circuit and played for the next six or seven years.

JM: You saw people shot, stabbed, and killed back in the day. If you had to pull one memory that personifies the "rough and tough" road days, what would that memory be?

DB: There are so many memories, I really cannot distinguish just one of them. I think one of the most traumatic instances was when a guy walked into a game and just blew a guy's head off who was sitting right next to me, and his brains splattered up against a back wall. I've experienced several instances like that. Another time, a guy shot another guy in the head with a shotgun as he was robbing the poker game. I had a very traumatic home invasion. I had several robberies that were very exciting, to say the least (laughing); it is hard to pick one. I saw five people killed on the north side of Fort Worth. That was the roughest place I ever saw.

JM: For you and your crew, the likes of Amarillo Slim, Johnny Moss, and others, how did you all navigate this shady underworld - giving as much action as you all did, flush with so much cash - and get out unscathed?

DB: We protected ourselves pretty well. We carried guns and shotguns, there were three of us who traveled together all the time, sometimes more, so we really watched each others' backs. When we did get robbed, it would be at the poker game itself, not outside the game, because we were very, very careful. We would cover each other. It sounds like the Old West, but it really was. It was very exciting. At that time I was single and didn't have any responsibilities, and I actually enjoyed it. But looking back, it was pretty wild.

JM: So, what was Doyle packing back in the day?

DB: I always carried a .357 Magnum.

JM: It's been written that Johnny Moss was kind of a mentor of yours in the early days. What did you learn from Moss and the others you ran with? And what do you think you taught them?

DB: Moss wasn't actually my mentor. I learned by watching him, not by him actually teaching me. But I observed. For years I watched what he did and emulated him. I always say that I thought Johnny Moss was the best no-limit hold'em player I played with. I sometimes wonder, because back then there was lots of cheating, and Moss would cheat. So, some of those times I thought he was playing so good, he may have been cheating. He might have known what the other guy had. But, he was a hell of a player.

JM: Who else - friends, family, and other poker players - have been the most influential in your professional life?

DB: Jack Binion was probably the most influential person in my life when it came to gambling. He and Benny Binion led and guided me. Chip Reese has been a great friend for many years, and we have been involved in many business ventures together. Sailor Roberts was another great friend. I stayed in touch with some of my best friends from college, like Ray Hibler. And two of the kids I grew up with, Riley Cross and D.C. Andrews, have remained very close friends for over 60 years.

JM: So, you wrote the "bible" of poker in Super/System. What was it like, collecting the greatest poker minds of the time and putting together poker's first real "how to crush it" book?

DB: It kind of became an obsession with all of us. You don't realize some of the things you know until you start talking about them. You start kicking concepts around and before you know it, you have these great ideas down. It took us almost a year to write the book. We put a lot of effort into it, really didn't hold anything back, and had a good time.

JM: Looking back, do you think this was a mistake or not?

DB: It was a two-edged sword. It hurt the game for the top players, but it created a ton of new players. I don't think poker could have ever evolved the way it did without that happening. I think it was beneficial in the long run.

JM: At the time, the book angered some people for giving out some of the secrets of beating the game. Who were your most vocal critics?

DB: Slim was probably the most vocal. He didn't like it at all. I would say that many of the lower-limit players who were very successful were all very critical of it.

JM: Today, poker book publishing is big business. Who, if anyone, do you read to enhance your study of the game?

DB: Actually, I haven't read anyone else's books. I have worked with Mike Caro and am familiar with some of his stuff. That is about it.

JM: Well, the World Series of Poker is upon us once again. Over time, what have been your personal highlights and fondest moments during the Series?

DB: Naturally, every time you win a bracelet, it is a fond memory, even though bracelets didn't seem very significant in the 1970s and 1980s. I didn't concentrate on winning bracelets back then. I played two events a year - the main event and the deuce-to-seven event. The side games were so good, there was no reason to play every event. I think when my son Todd won his bracelet last year, that was perhaps the most exciting World Series moment for me.

JM: You have bracelets in so many different games (four in no-limit hold'em with two world championships, deuce-to-seven, seven-card stud, razz, and H.O.R.S.E.). Do you have a favorite game?

DB: I am not sure which game I like best anymore. I used to like hold'em best, but there is so much study and work done on it, and so many people know so much about it now, I think it has diluted the game. I think my favorite game is deuce-to-seven lowball now. Your hand is closed, it's no-limit, there are more challenges, and you test your intestinal fortitude more with a game like this.

JM: Looking at the history list, the $600 mixed-doubles bracelet with Starla Brodie in 1979 sticks out like a sore thumb. What was that event all about?

DB: That was a fun event. A guy partnered with a girl, and Starla was one of the better players and asked me to play with her. You got to play against the women part of the time. We would switch on and off. It made me appreciate women players more.

JM: You won the inaugural $5,000 no-limit shorthanded Texas hold'em (six players per table) event last year. It was a huge victory against all of the top players. Many beginning players have no idea how to play shorthanded. What is the key to success in a shorthanded game?

DB: That is probably my favorite tournament now; there is more action and you don't have to sit and sit like you do in those 10-handed games. I think you have to be more aggressive; you have to move your chips a lot faster.

JM: This year, the mother of all events, the $50,000 H.O.R.S.E. tournament, will be introduced. Do you think this event will determine who the best player in the world is?

DB: I think it should be the championship event. I think you will see a top player win that thing. Actually, I'll bet at the final table you won't see any unknown faces.

JM: What do you think the over/under is for number of players in this event?

DB: I think there will be over a hundred; I'll bet there is.

JM: Everyone loves no-limit. Does it at all bother or concern you that that game dominates such a large percentage of World Series events these days?

DB: It doesn't bother me, but I think it has lessened the importance of the bracelets. You hear people say, "Do you know I won a bracelet in 2005 in no-limit hold'em?" So what, so did 30 other people.

JM: When you look at that pile of poker's highest honor (all the bracelets), what do they all mean to you?

DB: The bracelets are great, but I think my longevity means a lot more to me than anything else. I think that will be my legacy. I've played longer than any person ever did at the highest limits, and hopefully I am not through yet.

JM: Today, rather than the road, poker novices have the information highway, the Internet, and easy access to online poker. How do you think Internet poker, and the proliferation of players it has developed, has changed the game?

DB: It created a lot of players who are pretty good and are totally unknown. Some of these kids have played more tournaments than I have. Now, that is amazing. They might have played 10 a week, and I played 10 a year. Overall, they are pretty good. I don't think they would get along very good in the cash games, but as far as the tournaments go, they are pretty solid players.

JM: I overheard you at the Bellagio Five-Diamond World Poker Classic in December say, "Damn, these Internet kids are tough." In your mind, what makes a player tough?

DB: Fearlessness. I think that is the best word. They just have a total disregard for their money.

JM: You're helping develop this new breed of players with DoylesRoom.com and the Doyle Brunson network. How is business, and what are your ultimate goals with the site?

DB: The poker room is just growing unbelievably. It's probably the fastest-growing poker room; we've grown 20 percent per month since we started nearly two years ago. I think the ultimate goal is to sell it, because it is just too much work for me at my age. They keep me going all of the time, and I would kind of like to relax. I am sure I will have to sign some sort of personal service contract, but it will be less demanding than what I am doing now.

JM: I am sure the godfather of poker has tons of other business irons in the fire. What is a typical day like for Doyle these days?

DB: I get up in the morning and I go to my desk, and sometimes I don't get to leave my desk until nighttime, because of all the e-mails, business commitments, interviews, and business aspects of representing DoylesRoom. And I try to play poker four or five times a week, about eight hours a session, and I play on the Internet a few times a week at home.

I have three books in the works, but I don't have time to get them out. They are talking about a movie, and all that. I really don't care about that. The only reason I would do that is to promote DoylesRoom. They can make one after I am dead if they want to.

JM: Come on, you're never going to die, Doyle.

DB: (Laughing) I hope not. My autobiography is done, but parts need to be rewritten. I have a book of my 50 most memorable hands, and I am also writing a book called The New Hold'em that will talk about how things have changed and how you have to play now versus the strategy outlined in the two previous Super/Systems.

JM: Getting back to that new hold'em book, can you just talk about one or two of the underlying concepts that the new book will speak to?

DB: Most of it will be predicated on your financial position, whether you are playing to win a tournament or playing to be sure you win money. They are two entirely different things. If you are financially secure and playing to win tournaments, you have to play an entirely different way than if you are playing as your bread and butter to pay the rent.

JM: Many successful players say that money management is the most important skill for success. How has your money management been over the years? Have there been times when even the great Doyle Brunson was broke?

DB: I've been broke many, many times; however, not lately. When I was in my 20s and 30s, I was broke perhaps a hundred times. It was part of the process of maturing as a poker player. It definitely made me tougher mentally and probably a better player.

JM: What other skills does a player need to master in order to compete at the highest level of the game?

DB: I think the skill of reading people and understanding human nature are the most important things. I have always said that the most important attribute a poker player can have is recall, where he can recall specific instances that happened years past in a similar situation that he's confronted with at that time, and he remembers and acts accordingly. I learned that when I wrote Super/System. I finally figured that out because I've been asked that so many times and never was able to put it down.

JM: You were blessed with great athletic talent until your unfortunate accident that broke your leg. And still today you continue to dominate the game with your stamina and concentration. There is a minidebate about whether poker is a sport or a game. What do you think? After all, aren't you using athletic-like skills to continue playing at the highest level in your 70s?

DB: I think there is definitely a correlation. I think that there are lots of similar things necessary to excel at both sports and poker. You need discipline, you need stamina, and you need mental alertness. So much is the same, and you'd be surprised how many top poker players used to be athletes. It develops your competitive instincts. I think poker should be called a sport.

JM: In the Olympics?

DB: That would be great!

JM: Your son Todd is a great cash-game and tournament player. How did you help in the development of Todd as a player?

DB: It's funny, lots of people ask that, expecting me to say that I helped him, but he is completely self-taught. I didn't even know he knew how to play until he was in his third year of law school. He came home and told me that he wanted to be a professional poker player, and I didn't even know he knew how to play! It was kind of a shock, even though I was very happy about it. I took him around to some card clubs, to observe him, and it was evident immediately that he had it. You could just see it. With a sense of pride, I could see the competent way he bet and read his players. I think Todd could be the best player in the world if he had the desire that I have. He got too rich, too quick. He won a big $280,000 tournament when he was 21 and 10 to 12 tournaments since then. He inherited his mother's business skills that I don't have, and got the gambling ability from me, so he got the best of both worlds. He never had the broke days and tough times that I had. I think he could be the best player of all time. He just has some phenomenal skills and an amazing sense of recall.

JM: Stepping away from poker, you are known as one of the biggest gamblers in the world. I think Mike Sexton summarized it best in Card Player when he wrote: "Among gamblers, Doyle has always been 'the man.' Doyle creates 'action.' His philosophy and the creed by which he lives is, 'You have to give action to get action,' and nobody does it better. If you want action, whether it's playing poker, betting on golf matches, wagering on a sporting event, or proposition betting on anything, Doyle is your man."
Can you explain how this zeal for "action" came about, and why you love it so much?

DB: It is very simple. Most gamblers like to get the best of things. They like to get a big advantage. You cannot have gambling that keeps going if it is not close. I'm playing golf right now. I don't want to lock things up on the first hole. I want the game to be close. I want it to come down to the last putt. When the pressure is on, I excel.

JM: Can you give our readers a peek into the world of high-stakes gambling? What do you bet on?

DB: I used to bet on sports very heavily. I did well in baseball because we had a great computer handicapper, and Chip, I, and a few others dominated that sport for six or seven years, and made a lot of money. I'm probably a loser at football and basketball, because 11 is more than 10, and when you start laying 11 to win 10, it's hard to come out ahead.

JM: What is the largest wager you have ever placed?

DB: On a sporting event, I've probably bet a half million. But I've played golf for many millions.

JM: The golf course seems to be the epicenter of lots of high-stakes gambling. What is the craziest thing you have ever seen on the course? What is the most you have won or lost on the greens?

DB: I don't like to give specific amounts. I've seen people fight on the golf course, and people drive golf carts into lakes. Some people's temperaments aren't good. They lose their cool and blow up. Stu Ungar was a perfect example of that. He was a great winning player, but when he was a loser, he was terrible.

JM: So, you are back playing golf. Whom did you play with today? Was it a good day?

DB: I played with Daniel Negreanu, Erick Lindgren, Phil Ivey, and Barry Greenstein. I'll put it this way, I had a good day - middle six figures.

JM: This year, at Card Player's first Player of the Year Awards Gala, you were honored with the lifetime achievement award. What do you feel is your greatest achievement during your long and distinguished career?

DB: I think my greatest achievement is that I promoted poker for all these years. I've always been courteous and accessible to the public and media. I think everyone owes that to poker. Those who have their self-worth extremely overrated need to realize that we are still just a bunch of poker players. Sure, some people think of us as celebrities, but the bottom line is that we are just poker players, and everyone should realize that.

JM: One might think a "lifetime achievement award" would imply that you are slowing down. However, it seems like you just get stronger and stronger. How do you do it?

DB: I am blessed. I guess I have good genes. I have remained mentally active for all these years and I am lucky. Most poker players start going downhill when they are 50. I think I am about as good as I ever was today. I think being mentally active has so much to do with it.

JM: So, no little blue pills?

DB: No … (laughing) I don't need those.

JM: Looking back on your life of extraordinary accomplishments, is there anything you would do differently if you had to do it all over again?

DB: Of course, that is a tough question, because I lost an 18-year-old daughter 20 years ago. Naturally, I would try to rectify that if I could. However, I don't know if there is anything I could have done. Of course I would have changed that. Professionally, there isn't much I would do differently. I feel that everyone has to die, but some people don't live, and I have lived.